How Builders and Interior Designers Can Work Together (Brad Leavitt)

Welcome to the Creative Genius podcast, Brad. I am so excited to have this conversation with you today. And I’d love for you to start by telling us how you became a builder. That’s a really good question. I originally grew up in San Diego. My dad and uncles were all electricians. My grandfather, when he retired from the Navy, started electrical companies. So, you know, I grew up blue collar working in the trades through high school. And, you know, I definitely hated it when I was a teenager and kid. Like it just

You know, it’s really hard work, you know, being at school and then over the summers working, although San Diego is not a bad place to be doing construction, that’s for sure. But I realized how much I loved it as I got older, you know, 18, 19, I realized I loved it, went to college, studied construction management and moved to Arizona in 2005 and worked for a, you know, production build at first, always wanted two luxury projects and shortly thereafter worked for a luxury builder and…

you know, was with them five, five and a half years and, uh, you know, really grew the appreciation for the industry a lot at that time. And that was, you know, pre-starting AFT and the company I have now. So. Okay. Well, and I think this kind of ties in, but I know you said that one of your biggest challenges you might want to share with us what you had to overcome to get where you are today. Yeah. I think there’s a lot. I mean, the reality is.

Being young, mean, one thing I’ll start is being young in construction. When I first started, there’s something to be said about gray hair and being open. mean, not to jump too fast, Gail, but we work with designers on every project. And I know the design perspective is like we’re in a male-dominated industry. I’m female. So they have that roadblock. Even from the male side, being young male as you’re in a management position and PM running a project, that’s incredibly challenging.

There’s just, you know, it’s, I don’t want to say ego industry, but there definitely is, it’s more technical than people realize, and it’s very challenging, and there’s a lot of things to manage. And so there has to be a tremendous amount of coordination. There has to be a tremendous amount of education. And the more that I understand of everyone who’s involved in the building process and their scope of work and what it takes for them to complete and, you know, the predecessors’ success for those who follow them and coordinating that, you know, it’s going to bring value to me, just like our designers, which I know you speak to, Gail, that…

you know, the more they can become familiar with the builder side of things, like the more successful they’ll be in their career path. And so there’s, you know, it’s a very tricky industry and customer service is challenging and clients can be challenging. And, you know, you’re just battling, you know, so many different angles. Well, yes, absolutely. I think people probably under us made a lot of industries, interior design as well, because it is, is so detail oriented. It takes so much to do.

a really great job of it. having worked with a lot of builders over the years, I can honestly say that there have been a handful that are really, really good at it. And then there are some that are, they just shouldn’t be doing it. That is true. And I could tell you from a general contractor side, I mean, it’s no different than some of our subcontractors. Some of them are phenomenal. mean, very, very talented. They understand they’re great communicators. And then we have some that are just not great.

know, communication is such a key part of really any business, any relationship, but you know, in construction, it’s a big separator. mean, there’s something about construction that really brings out some of the poor communicators out there and it can be really challenging. Well, tell us a little bit about what types of projects you build. Yeah. So we, it’s interesting how that pendulum has changed. I mean, I’ve, I started AFT with a business partner of mine back in 2013.

so we started 11 years ago and you know, early on we were heavy commercial. did a lot of commercial that was, I did a lot of commercial, my background and had a lot of relationships in that industry. And of course we were doing residential, you know, remodels and powder bathrooms. And I always wanted to get into the luxury custom homes, but going back to kind of the origin of this conversation, Gail, I mean, being fairly young when I started my company,

no one’s just going to hand over the keys to a $10 million build, right? To some young kid who doesn’t have a long resume. So there has to be this path of projects and success and thought leadership and quality and everything that goes with building a business, that credibility. So over the years, that pendulum would change. It was less commercial, more residential. We were known for a few high-end projects that were nationally published. really put us on the map and social media kind of.

played a role in that as well as with the growth. And now, as you asked me the question today, I mean, as it stands right now, 100 % of our projects are high-end luxury residential, projects that range from $3 million to $25 million per project and range in square footage up to 35,000 square feet. So I mean, it’s definitely on the high-end residential, and it’s not that we’re opposed to commercials, just as of today, it’s all residential. Well, and I’m sure part of that is economically driven.

there are so many people that have been affected in the commercial market lately that some of those projects are just not coming through just because of funding. Yeah, you make a good point, Gail, because as interest rates change, which they did a couple of years ago, it makes a big impact because the reality is in the commercial world. And I’ve done a lot of development in the past. I I still partially dabble in development, even though if I’m not building it at AFT, I’ve invested in other real estate here in the Phoenix market.

The problem is with cost high, labor high, material high, and then interest rates high, there’s only so much you can charge for land leases, for rent, for selling a pad that’s developed to a big national retailer. so it does limit that commercial footprint. mean, if you’re building a multifamily project, they can really limit that back end. there’s so much risk that, it’s definitely slowed down, not across the board. mean, there’s still a lot of commercial activity.

depends on what industry you’re in. But to your point, pandemic changed things. We had a lot of people moving to Phoenix from all over the US, specifically California, Washington, Oregon, a lot coming from that region. And of course, the Midwest always to have their winter homes here in Phoenix. there’s always been a good market for us in this location. That’s great. Well, what are some of the biggest challenges you’re encountering these days with the building process?

Well, I wish I could say that things have slowed down so we have more labor gale. But the problem is I think across industry it has slowed down, especially in Phoenix. mean, we definitely have not us at AFT, I mean, across the board. I mean, there’s been a slowdown. But the problem is so many of our trades are aging out, right? I look at my father and uncles, right? And as they’ve aged out and they were highly skilled in the trades and our plumbers and

You know, there’s so many different industries that are impacted as they’re aging out and not enough youth are coming in. We’re starting to see that change. mean, myself, many others, I mean, we’re very passionate about, you know, letting the younger generation know that they can bypass college and not just bypass, but there’s actually a career that if college isn’t for them, they can have a tremendously successful career in construction. so we’re seeing more youth come in, but we need more. need

more skilled labor. so the to answer your question, skilled labor, mean, that’s definitely the biggest deficit we have right now. I can only imagine and aging out and yeah, of course, especially because I forget what the number is something like 1500 people a week are turning 65. And so yeah, for sure. And there comes a point where you can’t do things physically after a while. So

when you have those people that have that many years of experience, it’s really, really hard to replace that. Yeah, to your point, I mean, it’s very physical. And that’s the thing, if you’re installing pavers, I mean, here in Phoenix, we’re putting in a thousand foot paver driveway up the hills. I mean, that is intense labor being bent over and lifting, know, installing tile, framing a house. I mean, these are traits that are very tough on the body. And there’s a skill set, too. And that’s the thing. I mean, if you’re looking at trim carpentry, right?

You know, even plumbing, I bring that up, but know, plumbing’s become so complicated with all the different brands and fixtures. one thing I love is what the designers come up creative. You know, we have wall mount fixtures and we’ll have, you know, integrated sinks, you know, built out of countertop material. I mean, it’s incredibly complex and every bathroom is different. And so there is a skill set. And when you have someone that maybe not as skilled and they don’t know how to read a set of drawings or design drawings, it can be

very cumbersome on us as a general contractor for sure, or the designer. I’m sure. Well, let’s talk about working with clients because you’re dealing at a very, very high end. So with dealing with them, are you finding their behavior has changed over the last several years? What has been your experience with them? Yeah, and maybe I’ll ask you the same question, Gail. I mean, you can answer that after I do how it’s been from your standpoint.

I do feel that it’s not overall. mean, it’s almost 50-50. And 50 % of our clients, they’ve built before. They understand the process. Typically, the clientele I’m building for, they have built very successful companies. They’re very successful entrepreneurs to be able to build a home that we’re constructing, fortunately.

And so they have a great admiration for the project management and the systems and having a team dedicate to the project. Like that part is very beneficial, right? And it’s very collaborative between the two. And then there’s some that maybe don’t understand or we haven’t set clear expectations. And that’s where we can have to work through and negotiate throughout the project. But to answer your question, I think

The biggest challenge we have goes back to projects still take a long time to build. They’re not as fast. know, a home I’m building now is probably 40 % longer to build than 2018. And we’re only six years from that, but it’s still 40 % longer to build the same exact house. And cost wise, I mean, you’re definitely over 50 % more cost than 2018. And so that’s just in five, six years.

a home is much more expensive, much longer to build process, much longer. And I think that becomes really tough for the clients is to understand what building costs are today, you know, with cost of material and labor and inflation and everything else. It’s just, it’s a different market. And so it can put a strain on the budget and the timeline. And, know, those are definitely two of the biggest pain points for our customer.

And you mentioned earlier that you work with interior designers on all of your projects or most of them? On every one, yeah. And I think people that have listened to me kind of know my stance here, which is kind of interesting is that I won’t do a project unless there’s an interior designer. And I’ll have clients that’ll… I had a client recently that said, hey, Brad, we know what we want. We make decisions quick. And I’m like, that’s great. But if you don’t have a designer, I’m not your builder. So, I mean, we just really…

understand the value and the asset the designer is to us as a builder. So what specifically would you say is the real asset of the interior designer on the project? Sure, I mean, I can speak quite a while on this. mean, at the core, I’m not a designer. I’m colorblind. So I’m open about that. And not that that’s related to what the house finishes. But if we have a design book from our client or from our designer, you know, and this design book gives us I’m a cost plus builder.

I’m open book, cost plus, and so the value add just with the design book is that I have clear definition of what I’m building. So as a builder, for me to price the house properly, to build a proper schedule, I have all the information. I have the architectural plans, they have all the engineering and they’re, you know, we can layer them in Bluebeam, the technology we use. I have an interior design book where now I know termination points of tile. I know how it’s going to return. know.

the exact takeoffs I need from my cabinetry. I know where the drawers are, and I know the accessories that go in, and I know where the doors are and the cabinet hardware. I know shower head heights for my plumbing fixtures. I know lighting. When I’m trying to bid lighting, I know the chandeliers that are being specced. I can look up how heavy they are. There’s so much that goes into this. And Gail, here’s the core that I think most builders miss is so many times if you don’t have clear information.

there becomes this finger pointing. The product’s installed and one simple example, you’re putting in a barbecue with a countertop and the overhang doesn’t match and the customer looks at you and says, I didn’t think it would look like that. Why is the overhang not farther? Why is it maybe not in? I’m in a bump, you know, myself when I’m sitting on the stool at the barbecue top as someone’s cooking and we’re sitting outside grilling. Well, it’s really easy.

When we can go to set of drawings and say, no, here it is, it’s pretty clear. It called for a 14 inch overhang. That’s what we have. These are the stools that are specified from our designer, the FF &E. They slide right in like we’re good. What ends up happening is when you don’t have a diesel set of plans, I’m playing defense the entire time. So who pays for it? I’m a cost plus contractor. So when there’s a mistake or the client says that I didn’t know how this will look or I didn’t understand that this would be the end result, well, who pays for it? You.

the client, you paying for that or am I paying for that as a builder? Do I that cost? But then you look at building schedule. I can build a house 20%, 30 % faster if I have a design book because I’m not chasing a client saying, hey, what kind of interior doors? And this has happened. I mean, this is real life examples for Miguel. So five years ago, actually, it was probably six years ago, pre-taking the stance that we’re only going to have an interior designer, we have a client. We’re at drywall stage. And the client decides,

We’re asking for our interior door spec, right? And we’re drywalling the house. And we’ve been pushing on them for two months now for our interior door spec. And they decide we want kerf jam. And I’m like, OK. So kerf jam doors, that means I got to wait 10 weeks from the vendor to get these built. And I have to put the house on hold a complete stop because I have to put the jams in so my drywaller can come back and kerf them in and tape and texture like.

If they were standard door jams, my drywall, can go in, he can just drywall to the opening. I’ll put the doors, I’ll set them, and then later we’ll come back with trim and it’s fine. And so those little things come up that really delay me as the builder and then, and I could keep going, you know, how do you fill in your home? Resale, right? You know, there’s value. Yeah, it’s a luxury service, but you’re gonna save money because I can get you more competitive bids. If you don’t, if I don’t have a design book, I can’t send it out to three tile companies. We’re gonna have to.

send you to one tile shop and design it and then figure it out and we’re open to their pricing. So hopefully answer that enough, Gail, by me, I could keep going. There’s so many reasons why we have to have a designer on our projects. Well, I love what you’re saying because that is so important for designers to talk about this with the builders that they’re trying to work with. And they don’t often know how to approach the builder and say, here’s my value. Here’s what I do. That’s why I wanted to bring that up.

Yeah, it’s funny you say that because my team, it’s not that they’ve been trained. They’ve just lived this firsthand for so long that if I were to come to them and say, we’re doing this project without a designer, they’ll shoot me. They’re like, Brad, what are you doing? We’re not doing this project. And the way we coordinate and use technology and QR codes, which I’m sure we’ll get into, there’s so much value to that information. Information is key. To me, it blows my mind that as a builder,

You know, we build from plants, we build from drawings. We are the builder, right? And, you know, I’ve been trained and maybe it’s because going back to my history, a funny story, Gail’s, when I first started, I was out of college and I was working at this amazing $300 million hotel resort that was being built. I was a PM there and they had this amazing interior designer, Beth McGee, who’s here in town. And I always credit Beth because I’m this young 25 year old kid, right?

I was making decisions on these termination points. And she looks at me and she’s like, Brad, you have no authority to make this decision. You’re just the builder. You’re not the designer. And I look back and laugh at that now only because she was so direct. But at the core of it, yeah, she had a very thoughtful design. She’s had years of education. She’s traveled. She knew exactly the look she’s going for. And I wasn’t involved in those meetings. I didn’t in the selection process.

there’s value that designer brings to the whole look of the home and to the feel of the home. And it’s up to me to execute that. And the only way that I can execute as the director and the conductor of this project is by having detailed drawings that are accurate for my designer and architect. And then from there, you know, we can execute. And I would assume if you’re working with designers that you’re probably working with architects on all projects as well.

Yeah, same thing. over the years, mean, we definitely have just like design, there’s levels of architecture, levels of designer. But I think at the core, we do push back with the client, you know, to make sure they understand the value that I think architecture is a great example, because we see such a delta in pricing that they’ll come to us and be like, hey, this draftsman is just freezing math, 10 bucks a foot, but this architecture firm is 20. And you know, it’s easy to sit in front of the client and say, hey, here’s the difference of drawings you can get have like

25 sheets or 150 sheets, right? It’s a level of detail. then, you know, what happens, this goes back to my countertop example, what happens when your draftsman who’s not using bin modeling hasn’t figured out the mechanical in this modern home where there’s no trust space and where we got to redesign your ceiling, who’s paying for that soffit, right? And who’s, you know, and this has happened a long time ago where the trusses intersected the staircase and it didn’t operate. And there’s a window height.

issue there. And so there’s just things that are caught that, you hey, you’re going to spend 50 grand more maybe in architecture fees, but you’re going to save that on the back end. And it’s the same thing with the conversation we have with our designers. Well, it’s really great to hear your perspective on this. And I think also that is so important to have a great team dynamic.

And so the relationship with the architect, the builder, and the designer has to be really good. And I’m sure it isn’t always that case, but probably at this point in your career, you’re just working with people you know. Yeah, I mean, it is on occasion that we’re introduced to a new designer, a new architect. I mean, it is still fairly common with the size of our company and the amount of projects that we do. And it’s very common. Like right now, I have projects with

mean, I have one right now, the architect and designer are both out of state and they’re not even in the same state, they’re in different states, right? And so that’s pretty common that we’re working on that. But to your point, Gail, I mean, there has to be a lot of communication, there has to be a lot of coordination and there has to be a lot of open dialogue. And whether our teams are remote or whether they’re local, going back to my role as the builders that we’re the director, we’re not the decision maker.

with a director and the minute that there is a conflict between design drawings and architectural plans, time out, let’s talk to the teams, let’s figure this out and it’s up to us to identify it and not just move forward and make the decision ourselves. That makes sense. What does not work in the relationships between these three? Without dwelling on communication too much, I think that’s a real important part, right? It’s just understanding who point of contact is and how we can get decisions somewhat quick.

but I think it’s where, ego’s involved that you’re kind of running. And what I mean by that is we’re very involved in pre-construction and it’s really important that we’re coordinating with the architect and the designer. Cause budget is so imperative. The last thing we want is where a house is designed and then you go to price it. And it’s like, we’re not even close. And there has to be coordination between all the parties. And so we have had it where we’ve sat down with some designers and architects and said, here’s our parameters.

We kind of want to stay with this brand, this spec, this prototype, because this is going to align with their budget. And then we kind of move our ways and they’re going through design and showing things to the customer. And they end up picking a product or brand that’s like 3X of the one we talked about. And that makes it tough for us because we’re essentially the messenger. mean, for us, we can only price what we’re given. And when that price is high, we’re the ones with that.

you know, with the client looking across the desk ready to pounce on us. And so that’s always been challenging for us is if there’s not, I don’t want to say lack of communication, but we’ve communicated and then it still doesn’t, you know, either notes aren’t taken and vice versa. You know, I think for any designer, I mean, we’ve found it very imperative that all of my, you know, field team, have iPads in the field. And I have a stance that, if you don’t take notes, you’re fired. I mean, it’s, it’s that.

You need to be taking notes, you need to be on your iPad. I mean, it has to be charged, you need to be taking notes. And so in fairness to our designers and architects, when they come out to the field and they point something out or they’re directing or we’re having a meeting and the clients making changes, if we’re not documenting that with meeting notes and red lines and updates and as builds and all the things that we should be doing as a builder, yeah, that’s a problem for our designers where going back to it, I mean, we’ve been really big in QR codes. And so the benefit is, you know, the reality is we’re building

luxury homes, there’s hundreds of changes, very common, even with the full design book. I mean, this is a very common part of the process. so having the design book linked electronically, and we’re making sure that we’re always working on the latest and greatest drawings and they’re linked to QR code, that QR code doesn’t change, it’s in the house, but that’s always linked back to the latest and greatest. And so it’s imperative that our team is always…

communicate with the designer to make sure we do have the latest drawings and they are set online and they are linked and then, you know, we’re building to that. I think that’s so smart. I remember that from the conversation you and I had prior to this podcast. And I thought, wow, that is a great idea because the doves in the days before QR codes were really used, we were constantly having to update the design books and it was really a challenge. So I love the

the fact that you’re using technology so much. it’s technology is definitely a big part of what we do and the QR codes I found it does solve it because we we probably struggled like most. mean, we have this incredible design book and sometimes it’s in the three or four inch binder. I mean, there’s a ton of detail. Sometimes we have two of them. I mean, to be honest on some of these big houses and it’s really easy for this information to get lost and misplaced. And so now with QR codes and we use Build a Trend just being open as a software we use.

So having Builder Trend and linking that with the QR codes now, really our designer could go into the house, scan it with their phone and be like, yeah, they’re up to date. You know, they’re using the latest one. So it definitely allows a lot of checking between everybody. That’s great. How should an interior designer approach a builder and begin a working relationship? And what are you looking for in particular in these relationships? So it’s really good. I think there’s a few options there.

I put in my shoes, like for me, when I started AFT, I had a really hard time, getting some of the well-known designers and architects to call me back, right? That just here’s someone else is trying to sell me something, trying to get on my and, and in fairness, they have their core people they work with. They’ve had relationships for a long time. And so I took the stance that, you know, at the time, well, I’m going to use social media. And so I would post every day on social media on LinkedIn specifically. I’d say, okay, Gail.

I’m going to send you an invite on LinkedIn. You’re connected to me and I’m just going to post every day. And so through LinkedIn, through Instagram, I would follow these desired architects and designers that I wanted to work with. And I would engage for sure. So I wasn’t soliciting them. I wasn’t just DMing them and saying, hey, call me, message me. it was just, I’m going to follow you and I’m going to comment and I’m going to continue to comment and continue to support. Like that’s a beautiful design. I love that kitchen, know, whatever it may be.

And on my page, I would continue to post dot leadership. Here’s why, here’s the process, right? Here’s the QR codes we’re using. This is why we use QR codes, right? And so I was always trying to present value and never be salesy. Like if anyone goes to my Instagram, you’ll see it’s never like, Hey, call me. You know, we built custom homes, call AFT. Like it’s always very much this incredible project designed by X designer and here’s the details. And so you’re always trying to bring eyeballs to it. And so.

My strategy was always bring value and case in point, there would be times that leads would come into me like, hey, Brad, the public would start following me and be like, hey, we want you to build our home. Perfect. Gail, I have a great project for you. They don’t have a designer. So if you can bring a project to your builder as a designer, if you can show value to your designer by speaking to their pain points, knowing their pain points,

I tried to learn the pain points of architects and designers to go to them and say, I’d see them at networking events or at functions, hey, I know you’re dealing with this. Here’s what we’re doing. And so I think it’s across the board and a technique I’ve seen from some of my subcontractors is the same thing. They’ll go and follow me. They’ll support me. They’ll, you know, maybe it’s a weather resistance barrier company or a concrete company and they’re just supporting, supporting, supporting. And then six months later, it’s like, hey, you know,

We have this option. I think this would be, can we get on your bid list? Can we do this? And they’ve already built a relationship. So relationships are key. And one thing I’ve seen too is a lot of the vendors may have a good relationship with certain builders and designers. And they’d be like, Gail, I know you know AFT. Like we’ve had a great relationship with you for a long time. We’re an architect. So say it’s an architecture firm you’ve worked with. Hey, we’d really love to get in front of Brad. Could we get an introduction? And so I’ve seen a lot of partnership intros that way where it’s like, hey, we have a good relationship. They’re great.

I think you guys should chat. That’s great. OK, well, also you had talked about earlier, of course, the QR code and using iPads out on your job site. What other types of innovations have you brought into your building process? It’s a really good question. So Bluebeam is software that we use and Bluebeam is for anyone that’s not familiar. It’s heavily used in the commercial world, commercial construction. mean, fortunately, I have a lot of our team that has worked in commercials, so they

You commercial is not like the wild wild west at residential is, know, the technology information. And again, the projects are different, the scale is different, the costs are different. You can have more overhead. you know, you had that opportunity of us in software. So, Bluebeam is great because we can layer plans, we can have red lines, it really documents everything. We use Build a Trend, that’s our project management software.

All the design books we don’t do selections and builder changes being open. We take all the design book information from our designers and put it into Build a Trend. It’s unlimited cloud and so then we can link our QR codes to Build a Trend which go to the job site and of course our finances. Everything’s through Build a Trend. So our clients have an owner portal. I mean being open, but cost plus they contract their budget 24 seven. They know exactly the project stands makes it great for designers because they can track it. You know there’s no fun.

Not that, I mean, there’s a lot of things around your business, but just in the market we’re working in, it works good. Just that symbiotic relationship between pricing and options and change orders with the designers, the things come up. So, so build a trend, blue beam, you know, the QR codes I mentioned, and of course that integration of accounting in all of our projects. Hmm. Well, it sounds like you’re really organized, my kind of guy. We try to be, mean, luckily I have a couple of people obsessed with document control, so they’ve done a great job, trained some uniformity, you know, throughout.

You know, all the different projects that we have. That’s great. I understand you also have your own podcast and I’d like to hear about that. You rebranded it and you changed the focus. Tell me about that. Yeah. So for the longest time when I started the podcast, probably for the first three and a half years or so, it was the AFT construction podcast. And what was interesting is even over those first three years, I mean, no question, I mean, it was industry related, but it was very,

I mean, it’s catered to entrepreneurs, right? I would have a lot of people speaking about company culture and business and startups. And of course, I’d have building science and designers and architects. you know, a lot of people related to our industry, but I also had a lot of professional athletes that will come on, right? You know, I think there’s a lot of correlation between professional athletes and mentality to be an accessible entrepreneur, right? The crossover is very similar. And so having

You know, UFC fighters and NBA players and NFL. mean, there was such a diversity of guests. You know, I had had people from Stan Sox and Traeger grills, you know, the smokers and so people that are really outside of construction. And I felt that being the AFT construction podcast was just maybe limiting my base of listeners and viewers to the podcast. And so I rebranded it to the Brad Levitt podcast and it’s still heavily tied to.

The industry is very industry related, know, design, architecture, construction. have a lot of designers on there, a lot of architects, a lot of builders. So think a lot of people find value. have photographers on there. I have athletes still. but the podcast is definitely more towards running a business. A term that people probably are tired of me saying is that I’m a business owner that happens to focus on construction. And at the core, that was probably something I just didn’t understand when I started AFT and knowing

how to run a business and how to create company culture and how to a breeding environment of success. That’ll be successful across all industries. And so the whole goal of the podcast is to really help anyone. mean, case in point, Gail, it’s kind of cool as there’s a nurse that pulled me aside. I went to lunch with some of my team and this lady walks up and she’s like, hey, Brad, I’m a nurse at this local hospital. I’m not.

in construction, but I’m fascinated by your podcast. I actually listen to it because I think there’s so much value in just company culture and listening to your clientele and with the guests. so that’s been the whole goal is just to help people take six, seven nuggets from each episode. And that’s been my goal. I love that. Well, and I think you’re hitting on a really important point, which is culture. Culture is everything. And if you don’t have a strong culture in your business,

Then you have turnover, you have unhappy clients because you have inconsistency of service. There’s so many things that go into having a great company culture. Yeah, there is. And if you have a great company culture, you actually can attract the ideal client. You can have successful projects. I and as I’m sure you know, Gail, mean, if you as you hire people, they’re an extension of you and you have to make sure that they align with the culture and values that you’ve said and who you are as a person.

Absolutely. I 100 % agree with that. Well, thank you so much for your time today. And I’d like to end with three takeaways that you’d like to share. Sure, just in general, my. Yeah, OK. And maybe from an advice perspective, early on when I first graduated from college and this is my first year of working professionally, there was this sales agent at the production.

community I was working on his name is Martin. don’t know. Just amazing. So generous. Like he was such a great mentor. you know, to be open at the time when I was graduating in the production world, know, sales, the sales team was kind of up here and the contractors were down here. There was not really, you know, that don’t want to say level playing field. They looked at us different, a lot of them or just, you know, you know, means to an end, if you will. But he was very different. He was like one of us in a way, not just always like, you know, getting to know us and

motivating us and he always said and he’d always say Brad generosity precedes prosperity and Yeah, it’s my it’s something that I’ve always tried live by and he was always generous like always giving back always It’d be my birthday and I’m you know young poor kid just graduated college and you give me a handshake with a hundred dollars in it like just for no reason I mean just so nice and in every aspect of his life is generosity precedes prosperity and It’s something that I’ve tried to live that you know a lot of people like Brad why you do the podcast? Why do you go public speak? Why do you?

you know, why are you give advice without charge of port? I just think that, you know, the more you can get back, I’ve never gone without. I’ve been very fortunate and the more relationships you built, like being generous with your time and advice and knowledge, whatever may be, you know, that’s always going to come back in full fold. And that’s something I have six kids, you five daughters, one son. so they see I teach them that all the time, all the time. Like we talk about it. We live it like I mean, that’s a big part.

I think that another good thing that I learned early on was chase experience, not money. And when I went to do the Monteloussie, I mentioned this 300-minute project, I definitely was underpaid for the role I was in and the amount of projects I was running and things I was coordinating. But the experience is unmatched, right? Working with high-end design firms and architecture firms and commercial banking and

building this hotel resort that is a known staple in Phoenix, in Paradise Valley. And so Chase experienced that money because in time that money will come. Like if you get the experience, know, and surround yourself with good leadership, good mentors, right, that all pays itself forward. And I think probably, I mean, to hit three for you, think something I learned when I was 19 from another mentor was, you know, leave things better. Things are better because you were there, whether it’s, and just a small example he gave, I remember being

in like a public restroom. He was just done speaking. We go in and he’s washing his hands and water spilling on the sink as it does. And he grabs some paper towels and he wipes it down. And in every way, he always wanted that everyone was better from their interactions with him, whether your co-workers are better, whether the industry is better, whether your kids are better. I mean, I think there’s a lot of value to those three things. think their life philosophies that have made a big impact on me. And hopefully, you know, that’s something I can do myself. So I love that. That’s great.

Well, thank you so much for being on the podcast and we appreciate your insights and especially I love your last pearls of wisdom. thought those were great. Well, thank you, Gail. I really appreciate having me on. My pleasure.