Public Relations Secrets for Designers (Dawn Brinson)

Well, Dawn, I’m so excited to have you, my good friend Dawn Brinson on the Creative Genius podcast today. Thanks for joining me.

Thanks so much for having me.

the area and I really do appreciate it.

Yeah, well, let’s go ahead and get started and just share a little bit about yourself and what you do.

Sure, sure. My company is called A New Day. It’s creative communications and marketing. I work with all sorts of creative entrepreneurs that are your designers, furniture manufacturers, product manufacturers, anyone who has a creative bend to their business and themselves. On public relations and marketing, brand strategy, brand visioning,

into the designer.

product designers.

work on public

executive consultation, had the great good fortune to have Pearl Collective as a client for a number of years now and it’s been a terrific relationship for me. And I’m based in High Point, North Carolina, but serve clients all over the world.

I love that. I love that. Well, it’s always nice to know that you are feet on the ground and high point. You always know what’s moving and shaking.

especially when this herd of people come to High Point twice a year and gather together for market. So let’s go ahead and dive in. So most people use marketing and PR interchangeably, and they are different, but they’re interconnected disciplines. And so can you help us understand some of the differences and similarities between the two?

Absolutely.

valuable to those who work on this side of the business.
I think a lot of the time. Marketing is the all-encompassing discipline of putting together a strategic plan for your business, for where you are now versus where you want to be, and then how to get there. PR is one of the tactics that we put marketing technically, number of others, and to us, PR is public relations.

under market.

Some people use.

as a shorthand for press release and that’s fine. Public Relations covers an entire gamut of services and you can use separately from all of the other marketing tactics and tools and ideas. I like to look at it as integrated part of a holistic marketing effort.

perfectly.

Use it.

the dialogies.

the whole way through marketing.

Okay, well, I think that that’s probably a helpful definition for a lot of people because a lot of people want to get published, but I think sometimes they get into what is a marketing tactic versus what’s getting published versus there’s so many different terms out there. So I’m glad that we started with that just so that we’re all on the same page. Okay, so let’s talk about some specific things that fall under the PR category and which ones designers can really

use well and probably should be using.

Some of the things that designers can use in terms of PR. Public relations covers a lot more than just getting published or being recognized in some sort of location or digital platform. Public relations is all about creating a particular perspective, a particular perception of you and your business and then using that to influence

Public digital.

brand.

people to take a certain kind of action for you. That’s what public relations is all about. So we may use the press to do a lot of that for us, whether it be having a project published or an interview for you as an executive, but it can also be thinking about winning an award or getting some other sort of accolade. We also throw

or not that would

you

like.

events like podcasts and those sorts of things into the public relations, big pot of things that are happening. So there are many ways to leverage public relations in a way that is.

that in getting press, also other sports of elements of notoriety, again, how us as PR professionals or you as designer to change the perception about your company and to persuade people to do something specific.

that allow

the design.

Okay, so when it comes to pitching to editors in the interior design space, what do you see as some of the common mistakes that designers make and how can they refine their pitches to really stand out in that crowded inbox of that editor?

Absolutely. The first thing that we need to recognize is that the publication landscape, whether or not we’re talking print publications or digital platforms has changed so dramatically just in the last five years that you pitch when you pitch and how you pitch has changed. The policies around it haven’t changed, but what you can expect from it and how often you can do

there.

the way

around it.

really have.

altered. So for example, you have to be incredibly brief in any kind of pitch that you want. We as creatives want to tell a story. my goodness, do you see this

around everything. want to tell you all the details.

This piece of marble that’s over my shoulder came from India, and I want to

may, etc. Regular and smart, savvy pitch is really simple and to the point to an editor. It has to be something that will capture his or her attention very quickly. If that’s not the case in the first, let’s say, 25 words, then you’re probably going to get pushed to one side because these editors are even busier than they’ve been.

of

incredibly busy.

in years past. If there is something that is unique about your project that you want to see, need to say that upfront again and very quickly. No longer do we have the pleasure of publishing really beautiful environments. Everybody’s environments that pitching are really pretty and exceptional work.

or about something to speak about.

and are generally, they’re really.

be something unique. needs to be something

something sometimes a little controversial about it or a little different in order for it to find space in a publication. You also want to know what it is that that particular publication likes to publish. are you looking for? Don’t send a beautiful country estate to a publication that

about it.

Mm-hmm.

they looking for.

only does modern townhouses. Don’t send them something blue and white if they’ve done five things that are blue and white that you’ve seen in the last year. That’s just wasting everybody’s time. So, you know, let’s kind of get serious about it. So what you really want to have in a quick, simple pit, your contact information, clear, upfront, straightforward, how to get in touch

with you.

If you’re doing a project.

pitching a project.

They’ll want to know where it is, what’s special about it, what did you do? They love looking at the entire project, even if you didn’t do all of it, because that gives them context. Tell them again why it’s unique and different, and tell them that you will follow up with them in a short period of time. Also let them know that resolution images are available. Please do not inundate them with a ton of imagery.

send them two or three really great photos, maybe five.

beyond that.

Either give them a link, tell them that there’s a box available, put them on your website in a hidden area that they can go and find, but don’t give them 30 megs of fabric for you. And then be prepared for what may happen next.

drop by.

you know, the top, it’s just not gonna work.

I love that OK so then when when interior designers are ready to get published, how can they research the right editors or journalists to target? So what are what are some of those? Right ways to go about the research of who they should be reaching out to. You were mentioning, you know, don’t send a cottage to, you know, a modern magazine editor. So can you give us some other tips on?

how to get those right editors and journalists in the queue.

Sure. It is harder now than it has been before. course. Not only are getting a ton of information, and the more information they get, the more information they pull back from being found. I would say still, the very best way is magazine mastheads. That’s the list of all of the editors and publishers.

And the right journalists. Are they incredibly busy?

Likely it is that.

or photographer.

and writers and photographers at every magazine. So you can that direction. There are services that you can subscribe to online that will give you names and contact emails of editors. Some of them are very inexpensive. Some of them can get a little pricey depending on the size of them, but you can research those online. If you’re regularly publishing, you’re only pitching, one of those might

Pinky.

if your regular be a good opportunity.

Especially if you’re going to be looking for regional publications, you can find most of that information online simply by going to each publication’s website. So for example, if you have a statewide magazine that covers style and trends and you can typically find that online. You can find your regional design publications online as well. can download media kits.

at.

and all of those things.

surprisingly often the most of editors will be contained within the media kit and most

that’s free and you could just go.

from their website. So there are a lot of different ways that if you’re doing it yourself, it is a little time consuming. But here’s the trick. Don’t try to find everybody. Try to find the particular publications that are super important to you and that fit your niche and your comparable kind of work or your comparable leadership that if you want to offer

kind of there is finding.

area.

an interview or expert advice and stick to those to begin with.

in you’re

those then you are reaching out to

some major publication or a different publication that you’ve never heard of or that you don’t have a good.

Okay. So what are some ways that designers can take a more personalized approach to, know, so that they stand out? I know you talked about keeping the submissions very simple, you know, not a lot of graphics, that sort of thing, but how can you kind of stand out in the crowd when you’ve got this full inbox? I mean, I go to my inbox, I’m not even an editor when I go to my inbox in the morning and I’m like.

Okay, well here’s all the things I can go ahead and archive that are not important.

Absolutely. And again, we go back to how you can capture an editor’s attention quickly. So sometimes it’s about geography. For example, a particular publication, let’s say, you’ve been covering things in the Midwest and in the Great Plains states.

If you’ve been watching a particular, been watching a national publication grow.

Maybe what they’re looking for and haven’t found is something phenomenal from the deep south or the mid-Atlantic.

land and you can’t.

Coast, even in the subject line, mid-Atlantic coastal, mid-October, lugger, vacation rental. Right. And that would capture their attention. would open up. It isn’t a subject line that is something so standard like…

manner earned jury.

and that happened.

see my beautiful new project.

Because they are, although projects are beautiful, it’s just what makes it unique about that project. One special.

Right? Yes. And again, it’s all about being concise and being to the point. And even for someone like me who has done it for a number of years, that’s the hardest thing to do is to say it in his

words with the right words.

Possibly can to make someone stop just long enough to pay attention. It’s very much the same mentality as the Instagram scroll do something first and Being concise and letting them know The way you have structured your pitch and what you have done that, you know Your time is valuable

to make them stop. Second. what is that?

Thread.

that you know how to manage that, you know how to manage them.

getting the information that they need, they don’t have to train you on what they need. And if you set it up properly, then they’ll see that and they’ll be more likely to tend to that.

to do a lot of work to

I think the closest thing that I have a reference point to is when I’ve helped judge different awards in the industry, right? And so there’s all these different spots that you can submit your project or your submission or how you want to talk about it or the pictures for it. And it’s so much easier when you’re just having to click a couple different documents to kind of get the whole picture and read a little bit instead of clicking on

all sorts of different documents. And so I’m sure that’s kind of a similar process of, you know, it makes it even a better experience for the editor or that person that is receiving it to be able to make a more quick decision, I would think.

Absolutely, absolutely.

They want to respect their time. And keep in mind that if you don’t hear from an editor, that doesn’t necessarily mean no. Just means I don’t have time. Now I don’t have time to make a decision or I’ve looked at it and it doesn’t necessarily fit this very second. No. And even if you get a no at the moment, no doesn’t really mean no. No, just being. Minute.

That just to look at it, right.

not write this.

They just don’t have a place for it right now. That doesn’t go back at some point and repitch it if you’ve photographed it differently or you have done more, a separate phase of it you can take. But just keep in mind that you understand from their point of view this isn’t about you. It’s not about the quality of your work. It’s not a reflection of

mean you can’t go.

different.

it back.

that you have to.

whether or not.

not they think highly of you. That it’s not that’s not. So no or no answer shouldn’t be taken as a personal tragedy. That sometimes I will also say that if you don’t hear from someone, if you can give them just a little bit of leeway to think about it, then you can find

how they’re about.

Yeah, and we feel like

Yeah.

up in a couple of weeks and ask is there anything.

more that I provide to you. I’d be more than happy to.

Meet with you, jump on a Zoom, send additional information. Or I have seen one more photo. Do the trick.

Even in our daily work together, you have opportunities that come across your desk. I have opportunities that come across mine specifically for our boardroom members in what the different magazines are looking for. And you just never know if it’s a specific region or a specific type of project, but usually it’s like, we’re dialing into this radius. We’re looking for this particular kind of thing. And, you know, not always can you get your hands on the editorial calendar to see what they’re looking for next. So.

Important to keep an open mind.

And an editorial calendar only goes so far. They’re going to give you the larger viewpoint on things. Really, really common for editors to start down the path of thinking, okay, here are the three big steps. And the well, don’t know that term, is where most of the articles live. Magazines and you see the masthead at the front, new publisher’s letter and

There are only.

It’s nearly.

be stories in the well.

zine.

Look at that.

Then you see a lot of advertising and some product sorts of things. And then you get into what’s known as the edit well. And that’s where the big stories are. They may find want to change the articles in the edit well, because suddenly they’ve all of these great submissions that are using rich saturated colors. And the saturated colors or the, you know, what color is it kind of approach to it.

that they want to change up.

Got

people. They suddenly want to do a collide.

rather than they were to…

to do a singular script. you never know what’s happening behind the curtain in those editorial meetings.

for it will be.

Such good advice, such good advice. Okay, so we’ve talked about kind of how to figure out who you’re gonna pitch to, how to kind of put together your pitch. So now once the pitch has actually been successful and you’ve got an editor raising their hand saying, I wanna feature you as a designer, your design project, how can the interior designers that are listeners of us,

know that they’re really truly ready for that media spotlight. How do they get prepared? Are there certain steps that they should take knowing that this publicity is coming?

Absolutely. And I would say some things that you need to do before you ever it. You need to be prepared because usually when this happens, there is a hustle right after it. If someone says, yes, we want to do this, then there are a whole series of things you need to do very, very fast. Often,

There are send out that.

that you

that will be followed by an incredibly long door.

long delay where you see the world is coming to an end because nothing is happening and then there’s another massive hustle at the end. So you need to accommodate the editors when they need you to hustle. There are things like

nothing

to be prepared.

things like if it’s a project and you are ready.

We need to know all the details.

about that project and have them in hand.

from paint colors and providers, the rug, lighting, the furnishings, all the little details that you can go ahead and have. I recommend when you do project, you create a document at the same time. That is essentially the project photography doc that covers everything that you just photographed. So that if an editor says,

The

All the-

Do photography.

document.

drug is that within a matter of turn that around. don’t have to be waiting for it. You don’t have to go look.

minutes you

So have that prepared. You need to have your headshots already in the can, as we say, ready to go. The ones chosen that you love. If you’ve already touched, get all of that done in advance. both JPEG and TIFF, you also want to be polished up because they will want to know you. You will have a company statement ready that describes your company.

you need to have them.

have the, yeah.

and probably

the end.

a hundred words or less. You can do a much longer one. It needs to be this short.

they’re also sort of short statement about who you are and what’s different and what’s different about what you’re doing.

fun or unique, precious about doing. You also need to be prepared to answer questions from a particular publication. What happens oftentimes is editors and editorial groups will put together all of the projects they think are worthy of worthwhile and a possibility.

different that they were.

for one or two or three issues at the same time. They get together, start looking and they cull things out and they pull things in and they push this one over completely. And then they come back to you, they’ve done all of their work and they come back to you and they say, here’s our questionnaire, here’s our lease form, have this back. And you need to be prepared.

get together, then they start.

here and that one over there and they take this one out.

We need to have in 24 hours.

you to turn that around because that’s the difference between you possibly

possibly getting in and somebody taking your slot. Those questions fast enough.

if you don’t answer them.

Right, because once they have all of the things that they need and they can green light it, then it’s one last thing that they have to deal with. And it’s often to the land of publishing. So that’s that’s great. So what about for those designers that maybe aren’t used to being in the public eye or consider themselves a little more introverted and they got a little maybe a little stage fright that could pop up for them?

No, and we all have different characteristics. Strangely enough, I tend to be pretty introverted. Most people seem to out of their comfort zone. But I understand that hesitation to, oh, I don’t know how to this. You created something gorgeous. You’re educating people. All that is, you’re sharing that.

I mean

People don’t see that because I’m trained to be able to the public eye and do what I need to

how to handle this.

And you are on what?

It’s often true that when it comes to a lot of different publications, want to know a lot of They don’t necessarily want to know you. And that can be a real safety net. Particularly loving being in the limelight. It’s easy to tell your story and find that having that for it. And so don’t always feel like

for people who are not.

stand behind the story without having to step

Suddenly the Klee glides on your face.

are, you know, it’s really looking at how you want the situation to be revealed. I would say that they get notice that it’s the project or it’s the commentary that they are providing that gets notification for you.

want to handle and what you all about yourself and how much you want to say more often than not

Yeah.

theory.

Because we want to hear from you and why you chose this and what your vision was and it was an experience that you had that gave you this incredible mood board that put the project together. Well, I also would categorize myself as an introvert. It was funny. I was meeting with a couple of moms the other day to plan my son’s last elementary school party and

And we were just kind of getting to know each other and I’m definitely an introvert. And I was like, well, I really am kind of like an introverts extrovert because I can extrovert until I can’t anymore. And then I have to kind of go into my cave and, and re reconfigure myself and then I can get back out there. And it was so funny because these two people that had no idea who I was, they’re like, that’s not who you are at all. Like you’re definitely an extrovert, an extrovert compared to us. And I’m like, well,

I might just be able to hide the introvert a little bit better here and there. But I’m pretty sure you were saying you were an introvert. And I think that maybe I read on one of your questionnaires coming in that you were an intern for the Rockettes one summer.

I’m ch…

Yeah.

Is that an introvert thing to do? I’d like to hear just a little smidge on that one for a minute.

Interestingly enough, didn’t have the idea when I was young that I was going into public relations.

I

The idea of marketing that was that was not where I was headed.

But I had done a ton of dance in theaters and actually had an opportunity to be what they call a summer substitute.

hitter through the year.

Rockette was like the the pinnacle of what I had done a lot of other professional dance at that point.

I wanted to do. was really what I wanted to do. it’s my biggest sort of that I do it. Oh, man. Yeah.

Probably by her professional regret, got talked out of it and didn’t.

What a cool experience. remember my grandfather used to sit there in the Macy’s Day parade and watch the Rockettes and he was just mesmerized. And then he would say to me, he’s like, Erin, if you’ve got it, you got to fawn it because these women, their legs are amazing and they are so synchronized. like, I don’t know what’s going on in your world right now, but I like watching them too.

Yeah, it’s a lot of fun. And the interesting thing is it’s in that.

a lot like design.

You have to work really, really, really hard behind the scenes for a long time to get any kind of recognition.

the same long time to up to a level where you feel like you can’t in that way, play in that environment. But more than that, have replace the right time. have to really pitch yourself multiple times before you get any traction with it. But the interesting thing is, especially

and I’m putting this in error.

or sort of

to be in the right place the right

probably multiple times or you get any kind of

especially when it’s as apparent.

I did it. It’s not it’s narrative name. But you had to fall within certain terms very much like when an editor is making a decision. Right. You could only be within a few inches of a

with certain parameters.

certain height, either low or high, you have

had to have certain characteristics.

to be able to wear your hair back and not look too sharp.

our faith in all of the other things. It didn’t matter if you were most phenomenal dancer that had

stamina and you could do eight shows a

weak and still stand upright, there were all these other things that and so that’s how I have learned to translate in public relations because I had to develop that understanding that it really was it was all these other things

went on. I think that the trans working.

All of the other things that you fit a mold for.

All right, well that was perfectly woven into our storyline here. I love that. And a little bit about Don. So I’m always learning new things about you, even in all the years that we’ve worked together. So as press starts to roll in, how can a design firm handle multiple media inquiries without getting too overwhelmed? I mean, on a daily basis, we’re overwhelmed with…

The amount of work that’s coming and the amount of staff that we have to manage, right? There’s so many different hats to wear as an interior design business owner. So how can you help with that overwhelm of the excitement of the media coming in?

Sure, sure.

And it is a little bit time consuming like in anything else in your business. It’s taking on sort of change that’s necessary. It doesn’t happen all

It’s just like anything on a whole new channel of work. All the time. It’s not going to happen every

day unless you are one of just a very, very small hand.

of those who sort of live in rarefied air.

So what I would say is take a breath, remind yourself that this is what you wanted, and then start looking at how do I manage this in light of where I’m in business to ultimately.

look

Man.

I want my business to go. And you can usually get some clarity. You can breathe through it at that point because you’re probably hyperventilating at that moment.

So give yourself some room to appreciate getting what you have and manage it. If you’ve got multiple employees on the same project, that’s where things can get a bit of a sticky wicket because most publications, unless they’re fairly regional, regional publication and industry-grade publication, you’re going to have

the fact that you’re doing the task for. Now you can manage.

or it’s a regional public and industry trade.

people who want exclusivity for project. So you’re going to have to make a determination then.

on particular. What can I give to this one versus this one? Which one is going to give me exposure with the kind of clientele that I want or where I want to go?

Every year.

with something. Hopefully you can into that.

You don’t follow from snafu because it can back out. Maybe back and suggest different sorts of things. I hesitant to pitch widely.

can be very uncomfortable. One of those, an editor, you have to be prepared to come. Rooms those. Very.

project, I would rather target one national publication or don’t fall into those categories.

it. They’re now regional publication, industry publication so that we because what happens then is the editor has pinned his or her

hope on having that particular project the way he or she it to And then you’re pulling the rug out from under them. So that can be a hard thing. So be pretty careful with that. But if you have multiple in-

she thinks it’s going to be.

hard thing to say.

multi-queries, then that’s fantastic. You know, maybe somebody wants to interview you because you and unexpected view on what’s going on.

you have a point of view on some topic in the industry. That’s maybe one of the project maybe one

great, do that. As a product, one of them has to do with how your business or your team, one of a kind of men’s or women’s publication talking about wellness and business, go for all of that. That’s all good. And if it gets

you have built.

them might be different.

Good. Too overwhelming. You can find a person to help you with.

Darp.

Yeah, wink wink. Okay, so then once you actually do get featured in a major outlet, how do you make the most out of that publicity?

question here and I’m glad you asked it thank you so Gone are the days, absolutely nobody, being the same publications and so you’re pretty doggone shit. Your clients or your potential clients seeing

much because it’s where absolutely everybody is reading.

sure.

are what’s getting published.

It’s imperative that you understand how to leverage or give legs to is what we see in our industry, the jargon. How to give your publicity some extra legs. That is two things.

say here in the.

If you

newsletter that goes out. Very gracious. newsletter. Social media is a

You can be better about inclusion in your e-letter. Media is a great outlet and you can tag the public, you the editor, you can tag the photographer, really push it out there that way as well. You can to if it’s something that you’re very proud of. When you’re able to it there, you may be better

application you can tag the

You know,

Use it in your biop…

and your next opportunity comes up, you’re in. They have a press or an education or a resources section on that you can include. What happens to go up your web of a particular article or if it’s a link or if it.

your a PDF or ever have on your website.

video you can put that site if you happen to have a YouTube

Also on your website, YouTube channel or some other long form video channel, you can go in and talk about the inclusion and those sorts of things.

If you have a blog, you can put it in.
your blog. There are any number of ways to continue.

carrying this out. Take it on social because I think most of us are thinking about social these days. professional opinion would be give it all away on social posts. You have the opportunity to spread that out over little bit. Strategize how can I post because we all know social media is a content eater and you want to have you

I’m ready.

Don’t wait at one time in one.

to use this in multiple ways.

want to give it as much readability as possible. Look at ways to carry that.

air and

I would that through over a course of even weeks.

Okay, so let’s talk a little bit about the relationships behind all of this. So once an editor has featured an interior designer, how can that interior designer continue to build and nurture that relationship for future opportunities for coverage? And what are some ways to kind of maintain that visibility with the key media contacts over time?

Just like any other relationships, you’re a time developing relationships with higher-ups,

are working

level architects or builders or

These are real relationships. These are business, but they are similar to how you would create those sorts of relationships within your industry. So for example, some people like to… Not as if you have to, you know, send a huge bouquet of flowers.

based.

I think don’t go overboard.

to an editor that does that. I that’s something that you normally do. Okay. It’s really not necessary.

If that’s necessary, go do it. But it’s necessary and some editors feel a little receiving because they are making editorial decisions not for themselves, but what they believe to say they are serving themselves. But I do believe in

If their readers want to see both, their reader, not themselves.

Thank you notes. I do believe in thank you emails. think

that it’s wonderful to when they can to on social media.

When a program say you call them out and be with gratitude I think that’s very important area where you might be.

If you’re in an area and you’re able to meet up with an editor, you can certainly do that.

you know, high point market is probably the best.

place in the world to the most number of editors in one place. if you’re, you know, you just say, I’ve been at some of your time just to shake your hand and say, thank you. You know, some editors are, let’s say you’ve gotten to know them a little bit, you know, there is, you know, coffee shop, a little gift card.

down here and you know I’d really like to have.

That means a lot.

if you want to know your favorite shop x y z and you pop the

It’s a surprise every now and then that that’s fine, but they don’t really expect.

that they’re not looking for it and that’s not going to change the calculus of whether or not you get covered.

again. You can also ask them if there are opportunities to

if our opportunities meet the needs of their colleagues. And there will be chances for

And oftentimes, answer for you to meet someone from public. So again, just the way you are creating relationship marketing in your business, you do the same.

companion publication.

thing on the editorial side.

You’re one of those introverts and that intrusion of one’s where you can’t go.

feels like.

side and down the other. That’s where leverage a PR pro or a publicist because we already have those relationships. It’s our job to twin. You can say if you’re working with a PR pro then follow up and create that continued. That’s how we leverage those sorts of things.

to make 20-year connections to people.

It depends on us to

connection because that’s on your back.

Love that.

that reference of a 20 year relationship that feels very worthwhile and worth every cent. Because I’m sure that almost this this kind of gifting or you know, how do I stay in front of them could kind of go overboard sometimes and almost to the point of being a little annoying. So it’s great to have some some guidelines on that for sure. So as the press begins and the spotlights on the designer,

How can the designer really stay true to their authentic brand voice and identity when media requests are coming in as they’re kind of navigating which media requests are the right ones to say yes to?

That goes back to having done your early understanding what your business is all about. Are what then it can true to you sometimes these things come along and they are like a meteor shower of

homework beyond and.

who your audience is.

long or long.

stars in your eyes.

Can you imagine? I must. But it may be one of those things that just doesn’t get to go. This isn’t just about that. Or I’ll pat on the back. You really need to look at this through the lens of how is this going to propel my business? Where I want it to go. And so you have to be pretty times with yourself.

Be where you need to

Atta boy, atta girl.

this for my brand.

about that and say

You know, does this fit in with where I go? Does this fit in with the strategy? This one of my goals? Am I sure? Because it’s time consuming. It can be financially consuming too, depending on, let’s say you’ve done a

I laid out for myself is this.

baby.

Beautiful job of photography, this. Back in. Graph it a completely different way.

editor wants to come in and photo which sounds terrific until you get the contract and you’re the one responsible for all the Right. All the cleanup and etc.

stage and all the setup.

etc. etc. The catering the day that the photographer and everybody is there. You can run up dollars saying yes to something. You really, your ultimate

Thousands and thousands and thousands of

You need to make sure that it really serves adults.

Okay. So let’s talk a little bit about maybe the negative side of press, right? So what should a designer do if they receive negative press criticisms? How can they handle that without damaging their reputation? I think we see that in the movies, right? When it’s like, this is happening, we’re going to do XYZ to fix it ahead of time. And, you know, they’re pulling all these bells and whistles, but like, how do you handle that?

Usually, fortunates typically don’t get hit with a of which is really good. But no publicity or decent publicity, isn’t, doesn’t quite hit the mark. And sometimes what that is, is you get an experienced writer that doesn’t quite get your vibe and it comes off a little strange.

Now we’re in a really forced situation.

designers with a lot of bad publicity. You either get, you get.

great

I should do that.

The answer to that is unless it is fully inactive.

accurate, live with it.

Rarely does a designer get hit with bad ass. That’s actually associated with business that happened. There was a lawsuit that somehow ran, your name got associated.

a design. Right. Some power another associate with something

You know, they’re

another it was something that happened with a project and you had nothing with it but you got

They’re injury, they’re whatever the range of things.

Mm-hmm.

There are ways to, I think, graciously.

very

day.

not me, then, but you consult a PR on that.

didn’t participate in that. Really should. I’m not pitching myself for that. That’s not what that’s not what this is about. This is about.

This is understanding that there is a way to manage a certain reputation if necessary. But most of the time, again, unless it is fact,

and a level of.

actually inaccurate or you are being smitten by force of action.

beard, oftentimes the best course is not. But again, consult with someone who has experience in reputation management.

before you do anything because if you

If you off somewhere and that can just make it worse and there’s an old that’s still be true. You don’t want to get into a battle with somebody by the gown.

hop back on somebody and

saying very, very bad.

Okay, so you’re growing your public profile. Sometimes it can feel like the media demands can overwhelm maybe your daily operations of your business. So what advice do you have for designers to help like kind of balance that influx of media attention and running their business and still staying productive, right? Like we’re continuing to coach to, you gotta be, you know, building for your time and you’ve gotta be.

know, making sure that you’re billing for your hours and that your time is really valuable. So when you get these media inquiries, how do you handle all of that and still be productive as a business?

And a lot of that goes to your as well because your time this is about build a business, but it’s not early that you can create around right away.

overall IR.

This is about your

how you

something necessary.

billable hours. You’re taking billable hours from that. You have to start thinking about

Is this the appropriate avenue for in terms of the amount of time that I in it and what’s that going to do to everything else that’s or why. Again we get those start.

The investment that I need to

Either current in the pipe.

in our eyes and we think this is going to be everything and let’s make it.

It’s it’s it’s.

I mean, it’s definitely exciting, but you still have to have the clients and, you know, the business to keep running to stay afloat and say yes to the next opportunity.

We really do. And you have to remember that the national coverage is about creating visibility, elevating your brand. It’s not about getting popular. More often than not, from regional publications, even some industry publications that are read by consumers, also your social media.

typically

It’s about creating branding sure it’s about a brand. Those more

a J.

and all of those other kinds of things.

I believe you have to have a good balance of all of that to build a really secure business.

all in order to successful business. So don’t get too far afield in one or the other while you’re trying to continue.

the other, I’ll need to build that core business.

that you’re going after because you still have to work just as many hours as you did yesterday. Now you’re just

doing media on top

Well, and definitely when it comes to not just PR, but also marketing, it’s it’s that you can’t just dive into one thing and only do one thing. You have to get the plates spinning on all the different spots and then see where you’re getting the results as to where to put more of your more of your energy in dollars for sure.

Absolutely, absolutely and again with the PR angle.

And you know, particularly you can’t depend on the one and done, you know, published.

right? get and then and now what? And you’ve got to be prepared to do and now what’s that we talked about earlier.

You’ve got to those.

Love that. Okay, so for designers who are investing in PR, okay, how can they measure that return on investment from the press that they received? So we talk a lot here at Pearl Collective about key performance indicators or KPIs that they should be tracking kind of as the EKG of their business. And so what kind of KPIs would you be tracking to understand the impact of the efforts around publicity?

Absolutely. There have been years, even through public relations and professional groups.

bruise a gear.

associations, a lot of conversation about around he or to get your it’s very

measurement are because it is so hard hands around. You know, it’s almost like silly putting in a way it stretches and it molds and then we have thing that gives us really strict measurement and is really hard to measure because it’s all about much large scale measurement device like tone and

It changes. Never anything a really strong.

about a more real core quality and those sorts of things that necessarily apply to our particular industries. So having said that.

don’t necessarily understand.

The traditional way that we used to measure it years and years and years ago was literally column inches. So if you were to… number of column inches of advertising… That according to the coverage that you…

How would you wait to see what you got? But that doesn’t take into account the quality of the publication. You can do with it. Whether or not

and what you can afterwards. It was in a publication that. I tend to be focused on how does this move the needle? You’re a particular business. You have that out. And to me, that’s the biggest lift of PR. That’s where you measure it.

drove any kind of business.

very

to the goal for you and the goals that you have set.

y’all

I

always counsel clients to understand what the goals and the strategy are going to

are coming in.

Mm-hmm.

Then when the publications come, it happens to be, measure it against those very specific goals that we.

out or the blog out or you get covered in a digital

We can do it.

We have our already set out.

If that’s the case, then you start seeing the success measurement come in. Because populations is such a long take in this. It’s not transactional. It’s not I’m selling popcorn from a popcorn stand on the corner. And so I know

Secondary public.

that I was successful if I sold 80 % of my public.

our popcorn. takes a really long time to see the long term of it. And so we don’t always know that a client has taken. Yeah, because all this particular publication, they then went to your website, they went to your social media.

No. Action. months.

I think social media, then they filled out an email form, then they talked to their.

friends. So it really is one of those things where measurement takes a lot and it can be somewhat anecdotal.

It’s on time.

But we do know that success can be measured in various tools that we are using and the tracking that we’re using.

success through the various

If you’re interested in how many things then circulation numbers or blog numbers are for you and that’s another that’s a different measurement. But key measures is what did you do? You have it. It’s the dog chasing the car. You know, once he gets it, what’s he going to do with it? So be sure and

The eyeballs see.

Are they for you or?

are out there for kind of I think one of the.

and do that, usually are pretty successful over the course of.

Yeah, I mean, I would even think that as you’re starting to look at like your reports on your keywords to see if some of the SEO keywords are changing, I know that they are changing for us in interesting ways. mean, I’m starting to realize that my name is a keyword and I’m like, wow, like that’s not something that I was thinking about. Like I didn’t even have that as a goal, but it’s starting to show up in the reports. And so then I look at like, OK, well,

in 2024, what things that I do that maybe brought more press or media around Pearl Collective and Erin at Pearl Collective. And there were some things that we did. And so, you know, that was one measurement of like, well, that’s cool. And now what do we do with it? know, so that’s interesting.

Some people also use a little bit of social media advertising to go along with their posts related to publicity. Published in Iran. Want to put a of that. You can measure it is.

where some of

say you got regional magazine and you put a piece paper out on your social media. Another way that you either do a social media ads or boost posts behind that.

and see what the change is, what the delta is in all of your measurements. They start to you a good sense too of

on that and that will give

whether or not it’s resonating to people in your target audience.

Okay. I like those ideas for sure. Okay. So let’s talk a little bit about patience. So many designers expect immediate results from PR efforts. So how can we help designers set realistic expectations about the timeline for media coverage and the more of the long-term that marathon run that we’re on for building a public profile?

you were.

If you are being.

you

Long relations.

term public relations is a bit of a struggle for you. Let’s just get it out there and say it.

If you need immediate kinds of either you should need start building your business.

ratification or you need to start

quickly, you need to look at your opportunities. Those are things that you. That’s that website that. Happen to have a video.

Gap, short tail opportunity. You own yourself. Again, social media.

you you have channel, any of those, you’re open.
in an inbox magazine or newsletter.

mean, it’s a need for you to report to these studies yourself. You can have an immediate impact with.

newsletter maybe published

Those are things that can immediately implement. And you can also talk to them generally, and you’re talking to an audience that is more selective. The next kind of public relations should be your regional publications.

target where you want to go.

a little more affected already for you than others. So, one element of ring

That can be anywhere from your local newspaper if that’s still published, local magazines, regional magazines, state

to regional publications or regional publications. They will have publication timelines in

public aid.

anywhere from 24 hours to three or four months.

So with those kinds of… If you’re talking even digital publications of a national or print publications of a national consumer based industry.

If you can live

waiting games. Okay. And we’ll talk about that in a minute.

Also

sort that are typically rather than stream. We’ll talk a little bit about industry in a minute.

You’re going to have to have the patience.

That’s just all there is to it. Really lucky.

And sometimes you get you slot right in to something that they’re

working on three or four or five down the road.

That’s unusual. Less common than the typical, is, you know, six months ahead now and. We’ll say four months, but.

And we’re working

You know, we used to be able to. Editors are writing for lots of different public.

And so, could be six months, it could be eight months. I had 11 months to hear back the publication that it was yesterday published. That meant that they couldn’t use it, couldn’t use any of the photos for this particular project.

they’re writing much further.

One client who waited a

from the was going to be.

any photo on their social.

The homeowners couldn’t put it out there. The builders, the architects, the lands designers, nobody could use it. You couldn’t put it on your website. You couldn’t share it anywhere else. So you have to think, I’m going to pitch this to a major publication.

where she couldn’t give it to another public. All right. I see we be without those assets review. Indeed. You know the long area that I had was a.

case scenario was a giant poo.

had a home that they shot on their behalf, was a

that did not submit, someone else submitted it on a 100 % fine, and it got picked up for a Christmas issue. This was fall, it was Christmas. It went into the next year, it got shot, and showed up Christmas that next year. So it was 18 months where they could use nothing.

of one year went through that

in the fall of the following year.

nearly

from it. Wow. We have to remember that they

There is absolutely no guarantee that

even when you get to that point, for some reason or another. So you’re sitting on tenterhooks.

that it’s not going to get pulled.

that whole time. just have to be prepared that you say, that’s what I’m willing to do. And was very

to do and it was successful for them and it helped them immensely.

with them about it later there were a lot of questions about whether or not they could

go through that a similar cycle.

ever again.

OK. So you did touch on. If you don’t hear back or maybe if you get a decline message from something that you have pitched, but because not every pitch is going to land right, so. Do you have just some tips on? mean, in this world we’re so busy and it’s easy to kind of like get bummed out about things. So how can designers bounce back from either?

the silence from the editors or that rejection, know, what’s that mindset that we need to maintain as we are going through the media pitching process?

Once again, all that you really have to remember is it’s not about you. It’s about what this time for this particular issue, their readers want. So don’t get personally in that if you possibly can’t not about you. It’s

The thing

this editor app.

to see.

It’s really,

an opportunity.

opportunity then to go, well that did for that particular location. It works for something else. What else can we go?

work particularly public. But maybe we’re with it.

that’s also where someone like you, you know, a PR specialist would be able to kind of help guide you to that. you pitch this on your own. Like, what if we went and tried these three different media outlets to try the pitch because of these reasons?

Absolutely. you know, maybe what you do is instead of giving all of it to one publication, you know, maybe you’ve sat, waited for months to hear back and they’ve led you on a little bit with, to you soon. you know, it’s, okay, well, maybe what we do is we break it up too. Maybe there’s something that we, a certain kind of publication,

what you

you know,

Maybe something wonderful we can talk about or a certain with certain rooms here. can other room or other design thoughts or other perspectives.

give other rooms other space.

And so you give yourself other opportunities with it or it’s perfectly okay to

say.

I’m put this on my website. I’m ready. It’s phenomenal. I know it’s wonderful and I’m going to keep up with it.

going to take but that’s a percent fine too.

Okay, so one of my last questions for you and you know, I’m always interested in this incredible industry of the home furnishings business. I think that it’s filled with some of the kindest, sweetest, smartest people that are out there, especially as entrepreneurs. But what do you see as the future for PR in our interior design industry? Do you see that there’s

any kind of emerging trends or shifts in how designers should approach their publicity in the next few years.

Yes. things are going to change. They have started through the last five or six years and I don’t think that those trends are going to change.

Be prepared.

change pretty dramatically in a few years.

I think we are seeing fewer and

print publications, for those of us who you know, who love to hold publications in and share sheets and all of those sorts of things are going to continue and change.

these beautiful things that are through them and things you to morph change there

Things are also going to continue to change on becoming even more fragmented online and where you should be should present yourself in your business case online. So what does that look

the line thing. It’s

and how you

like we are.

constantly dealing with, you know, are there opportunities?

where you can get credible.

coverage that doesn’t require.

for people to be behind a paywall. The question is how democratic?

You know, the question here is little d, by the way, democratic. Do you want to be in, your publications? and that’s just a question that you need to answer for yourself. And then what of your own, own media and all of this, is.

What’s the role of media? think it’s important to be able to stories. For example, was talking to some designers earlier. We’re talking about how expensive is to create really beautiful photography that you might use for this whole conversation of how to do that and what do you do with it? Those sorts of things.

I think,

pitching publications and how long do you sit on it?

And my point is that oftentimes now it more advantageous to you both from a business standpoint.

Maybe.

on a financial standpoint to put out their own platforms and really going ahead.

these things on your own.

leverage that and instead of going and having to do a publication and saying, will you please do this for me because that’s essentially what we’re doing in a pitch is to create so much dynamic demand in doing that editors and journalists and freelancers and others come to you and say, how would you give us some of this? it flips the script a little bit. I think we’re seeing

for being what you’re.

what you are doing on your own site.

So I think a lot more of that in a lot detail.

industry.

Well, done this has been so informative about just media opportunities and publicity and PR and all of the things. I mean, I know that we all want to be published at some point in our career.

or we’re really excited about a job that we just landed that we know is going to be magazine worthy. So thank you so much for your guidance with all of my questions too. But what are three takeaways that you’d like to share with our listeners today from our conversation?

and how public.

it is understand publicity works within your particular goals for you and your business. Don’t get started. Really go into it in advance and then leverage the dickens out of

about it but with open eyes. Prepare to do all the work that you need.

of it when it happens.

Well, thank you so much for joining us. I always appreciate our time together. We’re excited to share this with our listeners and we’ll be sure to make sure they have the information to contact A New Day, your company, and follow you along over on Instagram and keep up with what’s crackleacking over there. And I can’t wait to, gosh, it’s just probably a few weeks, it feels like away.

of when we’ll be in High Point next and I’ll be tromping around High Point with you.

Absolutely. Erin, thank you so very much for this opportunity. I really do appreciate it.

Thanks Don for joining Aaron on the podcast and for sharing actionable tips about PR and marketing that can help designers promote their businesses. We hope you took away a helpful tidbit from this episode and join us next week for another as we continue season 13 of the Creative Genius podcast.